Revox B760 Tuner

[IRON PRIEST 231]

Y yo pensaba que los tuner ya no existían. Al menos acá en Chile las tiendas que conozco no traen.

[Mr_oD 3.303]

hace 9 minutos, IRON PRIEST dijo:

Y yo pensaba que los tuner ya no existían. Al menos acá en Chile las tiendas que conozco no traen.

Como andarías con uno de estos x 700 dolares para tu cadena MC

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Mcintosh-MR-66-AM-FM-Tube-Tuber-Works-Well-and-Original/283042485059?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D44039%26meid%3D6b6f53e2d08a4809981cb0f7588bea1e%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D11%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D123194402729%26itm%3D283042485059&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

[IRON PRIEST 231]

hace 3 horas, Mr_oD dijo:

Como andarías con uno de estos x 700 dolares para tu cadena MC

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Mcintosh-MR-66-AM-FM-Tube-Tuber-Works-Well-and-Original/283042485059?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D44039%26meid%3D6b6f53e2d08a4809981cb0f7588bea1e%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D11%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D123194402729%26itm%3D283042485059&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

Toda una reliquia Mc. Gracias por lo de cadena Mc pero recien solo tengo un integrado. Humildemente el unico tuner que tengo es el Technics ST-610 de por ahi el año 93.

[UPset64 327]

On 8/6/2018 at 21:16, UPset64 dijo:

www.fmtunerinfo.com, ahí está la lista completa

En ebay se han inflado bastante los últimos años los precios de los Yamaha T-1, T-2, lo mismo con los clásicos Sansui X17 (X=2,3,5,7).  Pero aparecen seguido varios clásicos de fmtunerinfo.  Ahora bien, por mucha selectividad que tenga un tuner, con una antena muy charcha no se llega a ninguna parte, sobre todo con las reflexiones que hay en Santiago, con casi todas la emisoras emitiendo desde el mismo lugar.

 

On 10/7/2018 at 15:18, Mr_oD dijo:

 

ya estaba posteado un poco más arriba ...  lero lero jajaja

 

En realidad estaba puesto como 30 días antes

[Mr_oD 3.303]

hace 1 hora, UPset64 dijo:

En realidad estaba puesto como 30 días antes

Touché! 

[Mr_oD 3.303]

Pondré esto por acá, por que gracias a este hilo me acordé que tenía en la bodega guardado un tuner que es un sobreviviente a mis constantes ataques anti Diógenes, los que que han terminado con muchos trastos como estos en la basura. obviamente me arrepiento de varios ataques pero en fin, 1° si no fuera por el foro no habría llegado a leer el anuncio de una revista vintage (se ve en la foto adjunta)  que me recordó que en alguna parte tenía ese tuner un Pioneer F-90 , 2° luego fui a buscar la info, en el sitio acá compartido fmtunerinfo.com, y quedé gratamente sorprendido de que pese a su endeblucha apariencia su gracia tiene, aunque no se asemeja a los monstruos acá mostrados según el review si da algo de pelea, lo use hace tantos años que no recuerdo como sonaba.

 

Spoiler

 

Pioneer F-90 (1982, $320, photo) search eBay
The F-90 is a simple but good-sounding tuner. Our contributor Bill Ammons offers this review: "The F-90 is a slim-line, dual-bandwidth tuner that has the same feel as its cousins, the F-91, 93 and 99X. I have serviced quite a few of them. The F-90 is a 4-gang synthesized tuner with a DMOS front end (one gang input - two gangs output tuning). It used a balanced FET mixer which feeds both IF strips in parallel. The wide path consists of two 280 kHz filters and one tuned 10.7 MHz LC filter can. The narrow path consists of three 230 kHz ceramic filters. The signal is routed through an IF limiter amp. The IF is then doubled to 21.4 MHz, filtered and down-converted to 1.26 MHz, where it is demodulated using a pulse detector. By doubling the IF, the deviation increases to 150 kHz peak. Having 150 kHz of deviation on a 1.26 MHz signal means a very good signal-to-noise ratio. This pulse detector is the 'Direct Digital Decoder' that Pioneer had hyped up. Pioneer claimed 90 dB S/N in mono, but the FM exciter I used was only good to about -85 dB. Since the F-90 only tunes in 100 kHz or 50 kHz steps, it is not the ultimate DX machine. I have modified one using my IF Filter Adder PCB in two narrow positions, which increases the IF filter count to five in the narrow IF mode and adds about 6 dB of IF gain. With five 150 kHz filters in narrow this is an extremely selective tuner, with a very quickly rising FM quieting curve. The DMOS front end is very overload resistant and the double-balanced mixer performs very well also. The main PCB must be removed to do any modifications or servicing. Please note that many F-90s are sold DOA or partly working. The most common problem is the high B+ supply for the PLL tuning voltage. The supply consists of a voltage doubler with a 47 µF/50 volt cap which can fail due to heat from the heat sink nearby."

When our contributor Brian Beezley told us that his F-90 tuned only in 100 kHz steps and had a different arrangement of filters than Bill's, Bill added this clarification: "There are three versions of the F-90. One only has 100 kHz tuning steps and was sold in the US/Canada market. A second version has a 450 kHz IF output for an AM stereo decoder, and a AM/FM tuning step selector switch for 100 kHz FM and 10 kHz AM versus 50 kHz FM and 9 kHz AM. The third version has the tuning step switch and a 110/220 volt selector on the rear panel. Looking at the schematics, all three versions use a single 280 kHz input filter. In wide mode there is one more filter. When the unit is switched to narrow mode, the signal routes through 3 narrow filters. The original F-90 I owned had 230 kHz filters in narrow."

Brian offers his first impressions of his F-90: "The F-90 is the thinnest tuner I've seen, with a two-inch front panel. It has nice big buttons and a pleasing digital frequency readout. No signal-strength meter, which will take some getting used to. None of the preset switches worked because the foam between the button and the switch had degraded over the years into a gummy mess. I snipped some weather sealing into little pieces and got the switches going again. The tuner zips right across the dial when auto-tuning. Unlike other tuners, if you hold down the tuning bar to slew across the dial, the tuner will not pause at each station it finds before continuing. I was interested in this tuner mainly because of its overload-resistant front end with balanced mixer and its low-distortion pulse-count detector. Both showed their strengths right away. I could hear no evidence of the RF IMD [intermodulation distortion - Editor] that trips up many other tuners in my signal-rich environment. The circuit board has remarkably few parts. Several custom Pioneer ICs do most of the work. I located the two wide filters right away. One is a blue MX, 250 kHz I believe, and the other looks like a tan 280. The tuner has three narrow filters, one of which is a 280. The other two, hidden in a sea of tan disc ceramics, are marked 10.7S and I measured them as 180s. One of the filters has a white dot, one has a red stripe, and the rest are red dots. Quite a mixture. The bottom of the PCB is inaccessible without removing the board from the chassis.

"The tuner has one annoyance: the Wide/Narrow setting is not stored in memory. I found this to be very inconvenient. The stations I listen to are about evenly divided between Wide and Narrow. That means I average 1.5 button pushes to change stations, and each time I do I have to figure out whether to press the bandwidth button. Without paying close attention I got it wrong about half the time when changing stations. Also, the tuner has no blend circuit. The button that selects manual scan also forces mono and mute off. There appears to be no way to receive unmuted stereo, but the muting pot is marked on the PCB and can be turned way down. The F-90 sounds exactly the same to me as all my other tuners. I think this is a really neat little tuner. It does most of what my Sony ST-S555ES does, and just about as well, with perhaps half the parts."

Here's a follow-up from Brian: "I just bought an F-90 for a friend. Fixing it up reminded me what a great tuner this is. Spectacularly low stereo distortion (no harmonics visible in the noise below -80 dB), zero HD Radio self-noise without modification, easy filter mod (got 36 dB IEEE adjacent channel selectivity with three Murata 150s), more than 60 dB separation, and sensitivity matching the best I've yet measured (15 dBf in mono for 50 dB quieting). I found it on eBay for a total of $47.55 delivered. I think it may be the best deal in tuners if all you want is performance." And one more: "One neat thing I found is that Pioneer provides stereo-separation compensation in narrow-IF mode. I never realized that until I spotted a mysterious FET and resistor near the stereo decoder in the schematic. Changing the resistor value greatly improves separation if you replace the stock narrow filters, which I always do. In the one unit I've modified so far, narrow separation increased from the low 20s to over 60 dB. That 60 dB is more like 50 dB if you account for the temperature rise that occurs when you replace the enclosure and don't attempt a hot alignment." Brian has a more detailed review of the F-90 on his website.

Our panelist Bob adds, "I'm happy that Brian mentioned the use of parallel JFETS in the IF stage. The F-90 was possibly the first tuner ever to feature this. Also of note, but not mentioned, is the use of paralleled JFETS in the buffer amp after the local oscillator to drive the balanced mixer, and a single JFET to buffer the LO feedback to the pre-scalar. The use of four active devices in the local oscillator shows the designers were cutting no corners, and had intentions that went far beyond the 'me too' '80s cosmetic exterior. This unit had some really groundbreaking circuits that worked very well. I wonder if possibly the team listed on the patents was disappointed that this tuner ended up being sold as mainstream item, versus being packaged better and touted as the breakthrough high-end unit it was."

Our contributor John M. also solved the preset problem mentioned by Brian above: "There are little foam pads on the back of the F-90's station preset buttons. The pads are supposed to press against the switch actuators on the PCB. After a while, the foam material breaks down, and it becomes very hard to get the presets to change. I pulled mine apart and replaced the crumbling mess with carved-up double-sided adhesive pads, leaving the cover strip on each padlet on the switch side. That fix has lasted 4 years, and seems to be holding." See how our panelist Jim thought one F-90 sounded compared to other top tuners on our Shootouts page.

 

Acá las fotos de lo que encontré en mi bodega y si me ayudan a aclarar la posición de los botones espero probarlo y ver que tal es volver a oír alguna emisora AM o FM.

¿Cual es la configuración correcta de estos botones en la parte de atrás?:

 

 

Editado July 30, 2018 at 19:00 por Mr_oD

[bavario 298]

Para Chile:

Paso de AM en 10-100  y De Enfasis de FM en 75uS

[Mr_oD 3.303]

hace 15 horas, bavario dijo:

Para Chile:

Paso de AM en 10-100  y De Enfasis de FM en 75uS

Muchas gracias estimado, ahora podré hacer la prueba. Sl2

[i prefer analogues 456]

hace 23 horas, Mr_oD dijo:

Pondré esto por acá, por que gracias a este hilo me acordé que tenía en la bodega guardado un tuner que es un sobreviviente a mis constantes ataques anti Diógenes, los que que han terminado con muchos trastos como estos en la basura. obviamente me arrepiento de varios ataques pero en fin, 1° si no fuera por el foro no habría llegado a leer el anuncio de una revista vintage (se ve en la foto adjunta)  que me recordó que en alguna parte tenía ese tuner un Pioneer F-90 , 2° luego fui a buscar la info, en el sitio acá compartido fmtunerinfo.com, y quedé gratamente sorprendido de que pese a su endeblucha apariencia su gracia tiene, aunque no se asemeja a los monstruos acá mostrados según el review si da algo de pelea, lo use hace tantos años que no recuerdo como sonaba.

 

  Mostrar contenido oculto

 

Pioneer F-90 (1982, $320, photo) search eBay
The F-90 is a simple but good-sounding tuner. Our contributor Bill Ammons offers this review: "The F-90 is a slim-line, dual-bandwidth tuner that has the same feel as its cousins, the F-91, 93 and 99X. I have serviced quite a few of them. The F-90 is a 4-gang synthesized tuner with a DMOS front end (one gang input - two gangs output tuning). It used a balanced FET mixer which feeds both IF strips in parallel. The wide path consists of two 280 kHz filters and one tuned 10.7 MHz LC filter can. The narrow path consists of three 230 kHz ceramic filters. The signal is routed through an IF limiter amp. The IF is then doubled to 21.4 MHz, filtered and down-converted to 1.26 MHz, where it is demodulated using a pulse detector. By doubling the IF, the deviation increases to 150 kHz peak. Having 150 kHz of deviation on a 1.26 MHz signal means a very good signal-to-noise ratio. This pulse detector is the 'Direct Digital Decoder' that Pioneer had hyped up. Pioneer claimed 90 dB S/N in mono, but the FM exciter I used was only good to about -85 dB. Since the F-90 only tunes in 100 kHz or 50 kHz steps, it is not the ultimate DX machine. I have modified one using my IF Filter Adder PCB in two narrow positions, which increases the IF filter count to five in the narrow IF mode and adds about 6 dB of IF gain. With five 150 kHz filters in narrow this is an extremely selective tuner, with a very quickly rising FM quieting curve. The DMOS front end is very overload resistant and the double-balanced mixer performs very well also. The main PCB must be removed to do any modifications or servicing. Please note that many F-90s are sold DOA or partly working. The most common problem is the high B+ supply for the PLL tuning voltage. The supply consists of a voltage doubler with a 47 µF/50 volt cap which can fail due to heat from the heat sink nearby."

When our contributor Brian Beezley told us that his F-90 tuned only in 100 kHz steps and had a different arrangement of filters than Bill's, Bill added this clarification: "There are three versions of the F-90. One only has 100 kHz tuning steps and was sold in the US/Canada market. A second version has a 450 kHz IF output for an AM stereo decoder, and a AM/FM tuning step selector switch for 100 kHz FM and 10 kHz AM versus 50 kHz FM and 9 kHz AM. The third version has the tuning step switch and a 110/220 volt selector on the rear panel. Looking at the schematics, all three versions use a single 280 kHz input filter. In wide mode there is one more filter. When the unit is switched to narrow mode, the signal routes through 3 narrow filters. The original F-90 I owned had 230 kHz filters in narrow."

Brian offers his first impressions of his F-90: "The F-90 is the thinnest tuner I've seen, with a two-inch front panel. It has nice big buttons and a pleasing digital frequency readout. No signal-strength meter, which will take some getting used to. None of the preset switches worked because the foam between the button and the switch had degraded over the years into a gummy mess. I snipped some weather sealing into little pieces and got the switches going again. The tuner zips right across the dial when auto-tuning. Unlike other tuners, if you hold down the tuning bar to slew across the dial, the tuner will not pause at each station it finds before continuing. I was interested in this tuner mainly because of its overload-resistant front end with balanced mixer and its low-distortion pulse-count detector. Both showed their strengths right away. I could hear no evidence of the RF IMD [intermodulation distortion - Editor] that trips up many other tuners in my signal-rich environment. The circuit board has remarkably few parts. Several custom Pioneer ICs do most of the work. I located the two wide filters right away. One is a blue MX, 250 kHz I believe, and the other looks like a tan 280. The tuner has three narrow filters, one of which is a 280. The other two, hidden in a sea of tan disc ceramics, are marked 10.7S and I measured them as 180s. One of the filters has a white dot, one has a red stripe, and the rest are red dots. Quite a mixture. The bottom of the PCB is inaccessible without removing the board from the chassis.

"The tuner has one annoyance: the Wide/Narrow setting is not stored in memory. I found this to be very inconvenient. The stations I listen to are about evenly divided between Wide and Narrow. That means I average 1.5 button pushes to change stations, and each time I do I have to figure out whether to press the bandwidth button. Without paying close attention I got it wrong about half the time when changing stations. Also, the tuner has no blend circuit. The button that selects manual scan also forces mono and mute off. There appears to be no way to receive unmuted stereo, but the muting pot is marked on the PCB and can be turned way down. The F-90 sounds exactly the same to me as all my other tuners. I think this is a really neat little tuner. It does most of what my Sony ST-S555ES does, and just about as well, with perhaps half the parts."

Here's a follow-up from Brian: "I just bought an F-90 for a friend. Fixing it up reminded me what a great tuner this is. Spectacularly low stereo distortion (no harmonics visible in the noise below -80 dB), zero HD Radio self-noise without modification, easy filter mod (got 36 dB IEEE adjacent channel selectivity with three Murata 150s), more than 60 dB separation, and sensitivity matching the best I've yet measured (15 dBf in mono for 50 dB quieting). I found it on eBay for a total of $47.55 delivered. I think it may be the best deal in tuners if all you want is performance." And one more: "One neat thing I found is that Pioneer provides stereo-separation compensation in narrow-IF mode. I never realized that until I spotted a mysterious FET and resistor near the stereo decoder in the schematic. Changing the resistor value greatly improves separation if you replace the stock narrow filters, which I always do. In the one unit I've modified so far, narrow separation increased from the low 20s to over 60 dB. That 60 dB is more like 50 dB if you account for the temperature rise that occurs when you replace the enclosure and don't attempt a hot alignment." Brian has a more detailed review of the F-90 on his website.

Our panelist Bob adds, "I'm happy that Brian mentioned the use of parallel JFETS in the IF stage. The F-90 was possibly the first tuner ever to feature this. Also of note, but not mentioned, is the use of paralleled JFETS in the buffer amp after the local oscillator to drive the balanced mixer, and a single JFET to buffer the LO feedback to the pre-scalar. The use of four active devices in the local oscillator shows the designers were cutting no corners, and had intentions that went far beyond the 'me too' '80s cosmetic exterior. This unit had some really groundbreaking circuits that worked very well. I wonder if possibly the team listed on the patents was disappointed that this tuner ended up being sold as mainstream item, versus being packaged better and touted as the breakthrough high-end unit it was."

Our contributor John M. also solved the preset problem mentioned by Brian above: "There are little foam pads on the back of the F-90's station preset buttons. The pads are supposed to press against the switch actuators on the PCB. After a while, the foam material breaks down, and it becomes very hard to get the presets to change. I pulled mine apart and replaced the crumbling mess with carved-up double-sided adhesive pads, leaving the cover strip on each padlet on the switch side. That fix has lasted 4 years, and seems to be holding." See how our panelist Jim thought one F-90 sounded compared to other top tuners on our Shootouts page.

 

Acá las fotos de lo que encontré en mi bodega y si me ayudan a aclarar la posición de los botones espero probarlo y ver que tal es volver a oír alguna emisora AM o FM.

¿Cual es la configuración correcta de estos botones en la parte de atrás?:

 

 

Recuerdo con aprecio un tuner Pioneer muy sobrio analógico que tuve. Era muy simple, de aluminio y con una calidad de sonido increíble. 

Trataré de dar con el modelo para dejarlo como dato para alguien que se cruce con uno.

Creo que era este:

Editado July 31, 2018 at 18:43 por i prefer analogues

[jvenegasc 161]

Que entretenido el hilo, también tengo un tuner pero más moderno un Onkyo T-4070 y como muchos dicen las radios de hoy transmiten mucho con archivos comprimidos, además que actualmente hay mucha interferencia electromagnética a diferencia en tiempos pasados 😭😭😭jajjaja que empeora la recepción de la señal y por ende el sonido. Para mejorar la recepción de mi tuner incorporé una antena FM Magnum dynalab ST-2 con cable coaxial RG6 que recomienda el fabricante y la verdad que el cambio fue muy notorio 😳😁. Y así no tuve que cambiar el tuner.

http://www.magnumdynalab.com/st-2-omnidirectional-fm-antenna/

 

[Mr_oD 3.303]

1 hour ago, jvenegasc dijo:

Que entretenido el hilo, también tengo un tuner pero más moderno un Onkyo T-4070 y como muchos dicen las radios de hoy transmiten mucho con archivos comprimidos, además que actualmente hay mucha interferencia electromagnética a diferencia en tiempos pasados 😭😭😭jajjaja que empeora la recepción de la señal y por ende el sonido. Para mejorar la recepción de mi tuner incorporé una antena FM Magnum dynalab ST-2 con cable coaxial RG6 que recomienda el fabricante y la verdad que el cambio fue muy notorio 😳😁. Y así no tuve que cambiar el tuner.

http://www.magnumdynalab.com/st-2-omnidirectional-fm-antenna/

 

Buen dato, es una antena de veras de veritas, 

[bavario 298]

hace 21 horas, jvenegasc dijo:

Que entretenido el hilo, también tengo un tuner pero más moderno un Onkyo T-4070 y como muchos dicen las radios de hoy transmiten mucho con archivos comprimidos, además que actualmente hay mucha interferencia electromagnética a diferencia en tiempos pasados 😭😭😭jajjaja que empeora la recepción de la señal y por ende el sonido. Para mejorar la recepción de mi tuner incorporé una antena FM Magnum dynalab ST-2 con cable coaxial RG6 que recomienda el fabricante y la verdad que el cambio fue muy notorio 😳😁. Y así no tuve que cambiar el tuner.

http://www.magnumdynalab.com/st-2-omnidirectional-fm-antenna/

 

Y esa donde la consigues?

 

saludos 

[UPset64 327]

hace 3 horas, bavario dijo:

Y esa donde la consigues?

saludos 

Esantena no tiene diler por aquí en la Capitanía General.  Creo que en ebay encontré ese tipo de antena (Dipolo) más barata y más digamos cotota.  El ST2 salía como 100 USD hace años y la alternativa salía mas conveniente.

JVenegas podría decir cúanto le salió y el transporte -Mide como 1 metro la cosa,,, y quizás cuánto la tendrán en la aduana real de la capitanía.

[jvenegasc 161]

hace 5 horas, bavario dijo:

Y esa donde la consigues?

 

saludos 

En eBay la compré y puesta en la puerta de la casa cerca de 130 mil aproximadamente. Efectivamente mide un metro pero como es estilizada la puedes ubicar en cualquier parte de la casa o dpto (exterior) ni se nota.

 

1 hour ago, UPset64 dijo:

Esantena no tiene diler por aquí en la Capitanía General.  Creo que en ebay encontré ese tipo de antena (Dipolo) más barata y más digamos cotota.  El ST2 salía como 100 USD hace años y la alternativa salía mas conveniente.

JVenegas podría decir cúanto le salió y el transporte -Mide como 1 metro la cosa,,, y quizás cuánto la tendrán en la aduana real de la capitanía.

 

[jvenegasc 161]

Acá un vídeo donde se aprecia el tamaño de la antena.

 

[cdarville 137]

On 31/7/2018 at 19:36, jvenegasc dijo:

Que entretenido el hilo, también tengo un tuner pero más moderno un Onkyo T-4070 y como muchos dicen las radios de hoy transmiten mucho con archivos comprimidos, además que actualmente hay mucha interferencia electromagnética a diferencia en tiempos pasados 😭😭😭jajjaja que empeora la recepción de la señal y por ende el sonido. Para mejorar la recepción de mi tuner incorporé una antena FM Magnum dynalab ST-2 con cable coaxial RG6 que recomienda el fabricante y la verdad que el cambio fue muy notorio 😳😁. Y así no tuve que cambiar el tuner.

http://www.magnumdynalab.com/st-2-omnidirectional-fm-antenna/

 

Esa antena funcionará para tuners/receivers más antiguos? Si no me equivoco mi Sansui no tiene un conector coaxial para antena.

Gracias estimado! :)

[jvenegasc 161]

hace 32 minutos, cdarville dijo:

Esa antena funcionará para tuners/receivers más antiguos? Si no me equivoco mi Sansui no tiene un conector coaxial para antena.

Gracias estimado! :)

Hola, puedes usar un adaptador como este:

 

[cdarville 137]

hace 2 minutos, jvenegasc dijo:

Hola, puedes usar un adaptador como este:

 

Wena, se agradece viejo!

[herbert 66]

On 8/2/2018 at 9:50 AM, cdarville said:

Esa antena funcionará para tuners/receivers más antiguos? Si no me equivoco mi Sansui no tiene un conector coaxial para antena.

Gracias estimado! :)

Algunos Sansui que conozco tienen terminales atornillados en 75 y 400 Ohm. Recomiendo pelar el coaxial un par de centímetros y conectar el alambre central al terminal 75 Ohm y la malla al terminal GND (tierra).

 

[jvenegasc 161]

On 31-07-2018 at 20:56, Mr_oD dijo:

Buen dato, es una antena de veras de veritas, 

Estás antenas en amazon se agotaron súper rápido. Alguien compró alguna???